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SawStop Sues Bosch over REAXX Table Saw

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  • #609477

    Guys good news, lol

    Is this real.

    No it’s not, Our new President has a lot more important things to deal with that patent laws.

    Not trying to be political here but it would not be consistent with his mandate to save a German made product over one (SawStop) that is made in the USA. Makes no sense. The pic is obviously doctored.

    I have no idea where the REAXX is made but it’s not in the USA. I’d guess it’s made right where the other Bosch table saws are made. China.

    I actually found out from reading on the FOG since writting that that the SS is not made in the US either.

    Nope -made in Taiwan

    #618402
    #618405
    Doobie
    Moderator
    #618408
    Austin
    Pro
    Covington, KY

    Yeah they might try a few other things like appeals and what not but you better believe as soon as that patient is up in like 3 or 4 years Bosch is going to come at them hard.

    #618417
    JimDaddyO
    Pro
    Wawa, ON

    Yeah they might try a few other things like appeals and what not but you better believe as soon as that patient is up in like 3 or 4 years Bosch is going to come at them hard.

    I hope so….to the point where they design and develop a cabinet saw line.

    My You Tube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCA5AretE3xPoVDV61AxUdUA

    I don't do a fast job. I don't do a slow job. I do a half fast job.

    #618446
    theamcguy
    Pro
    Fayetteville, NC

    Im not a lawyer, but I think this means Reaxx is dead

    Not only is dead but dead and buried. The order prohibits Bisch from not only importing the saw into the US but spare parts and the cartridges as well. Ouch. Anyone that has one cannot even buy the cartridges in Canada or Europe and get them sent in.

    Automotive Pro
    Fayetteville, NC

    #618452
    Austin
    Pro
    Covington, KY

    Im not a lawyer, but I think this means Reaxx is dead

    Not only is dead but dead and buried. The order prohibits Bisch from not only importing the saw into the US but spare parts and the cartridges as well. Ouch. Anyone that has one cannot even buy the cartridges in Canada or Europe and get them sent in.

    Not true on the spare parts and cartridges. The cartridges don’t infringe on the patent at all. Anyone who has a reaxx has nothing to worry about. Also all the reaxx that are in the country and at suppliers stores can be sold till the inventory is gone.

    #618462

    Im not a lawyer, but I think this means Reaxx is dead

    Not only is dead but dead and buried. The order prohibits Bisch from not only importing the saw into the US but spare parts and the cartridges as well. Ouch. Anyone that has one cannot even buy the cartridges in Canada or Europe and get them sent in.

    Not true on the spare parts and cartridges. The cartridges don’t infringe on the patent at all. Anyone who has a reaxx has nothing to worry about. Also all the reaxx that are in the country and at suppliers stores can be sold till the inventory is gone.

    The ITC has banned the import of the cartridges as well, but Bosch has said that they will simply manufacture the cartridges in the USA since the ban is on import not manufacture or sale

    Considering that the ITC is limited in power to international trade, I wonder if Bosch could manufacture Reaxx saws in the USA and keep going. Bosch could probably afford the extra cost to manufacture, if they wanted to go to war

    #618474
    jkirk
    Moderator
    halifax, nova scotia

    either way with the block in place if i were a reaxx owner i might be inclined to drop a little extra and get more than just one replacement cartridge just to be safe no pun intended.. as in the future if they are hard to come by still have one on hand

    heres a tip, dont fart in a space suit

    #618476
    smallerstick
    Pro
    North Bay, ON

    It will be interesting to see where this goes. Manufacture in the US would be one option, of course, but at what cost? At what possible benefit?

    BE the change you want to see.
    Even if you can’t Be The Pro… Be The Poster you’d want to read.

    #618479

    It will be interesting to see where this goes. Manufacture in the US would be one option, of course, but at what cost? At what possible benefit?

    Im a spiteful person sometimes, so I could imagine selling at a loss until the SS patent is up (only a about 5 years away) and doing so to hurt Sawstop, perhaps even licensing the tech to the American cabinet saw companies. In their place, they could put so much pressure on SS that Glass would have the choice of shrinking, selling, or closing

    But Im a spiteful person sometimes

    #618535
    DirtyWhiteBoy
    Pro
    Honolulu,, Hi.

    Im not a lawyer, but I think this means Reaxx is dead

    http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20170328005195/en/ITC-SawStop-Ruling-Effect-Bosch-Import-Sell

    Yup It’s dead, well the good news is that it’s nice to know if and when you have an idea it’s protected by US law.

    #618548
    r-ice
    Pro
    Durham region, ON

    It will be interesting to see where this goes. Manufacture in the US would be one option, of course, but at what cost? At what possible benefit?

    Im a spiteful person sometimes, so I could imagine selling at a loss until the SS patent is up (only a about 5 years away) and doing so to hurt Sawstop, perhaps even licensing the tech to the American cabinet saw companies. In their place, they could put so much pressure on SS that Glass would have the choice of shrinking, selling, or closing

    But Im a spiteful person sometimes

    is that legal? to sell at a loss to kill the competition? that would be ruthless.

    #618556

    Im not a lawyer, but I think this means Reaxx is dead

    http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20170328005195/en/ITC-SawStop-Ruling-Effect-Bosch-Import-Sell

    Yup It’s dead, well the good news is that it’s nice to know if and when you have an idea it’s protected by US law.

    Flip side, you make a better version and the guy who made the old one wont let you sell it. Seems anti-capitalist, and against improving on designs.

    Not to say I disagree with the ideal of intellecual property, but (as someone with his name on a half dozen patents) the system is broken and more geared to lawsuits and patent trolling than to protecting the little guy with an idea

    Either way, this is the ITC. They can only rule on what can and cannot be imported. Wish they did more about the cheap alibaba knockoffs and left stuff like this to the real courts. This isnt a patent violation suit, the bar to an ITC ban is much lower and often comes down to whether the judge understands the nuances

    I really do think the Bosch is an iterative improvement. A better mousetrap. In a just world, they would have to pay a small license to sawstop for the patent similarity. I think you are allowed 40% overlap though. Cant be much more than a couple of points over, as I understand it

    #618560

    It will be interesting to see where this goes. Manufacture in the US would be one option, of course, but at what cost? At what possible benefit?

    Im a spiteful person sometimes, so I could imagine selling at a loss until the SS patent is up (only a about 5 years away) and doing so to hurt Sawstop, perhaps even licensing the tech to the American cabinet saw companies. In their place, they could put so much pressure on SS that Glass would have the choice of shrinking, selling, or closing

    But Im a spiteful person sometimes

    is that legal? to sell at a loss to kill the competition? that would be ruthless.

    Yes, it is. And common.

    A company has fiduciary responsibilities to the owners/shareholders. If losing money on one line item is strategic and leads to better profits it is – in the business sense of the word – unethical to not do it. The goal of a capitalistic corporation is not to compete. It is to win. The monopoly that happens when they win is a side effect but usually someone else shows up to knock them off their podium (remember Nokia, Motorola, Eriksson, Nortel, and Microsoft?) all were close to monopolies in some aspects of their offerings. Now, those that survived are shadows of what they had been

    #618562
    DirtyWhiteBoy
    Pro
    Honolulu,, Hi.

    is that legal? to sell at a loss to kill the competition? that would be ruthless.

    Yes , it happens over here with airlines.

    #618577

    It will be interesting to see where this goes. Manufacture in the US would be one option, of course, but at what cost? At what possible benefit?

    Im a spiteful person sometimes, so I could imagine selling at a loss until the SS patent is up (only a about 5 years away) and doing so to hurt Sawstop, perhaps even licensing the tech to the American cabinet saw companies. In their place, they could put so much pressure on SS that Glass would have the choice of shrinking, selling, or closing

    But Im a spiteful person sometimes

    is that legal? to sell at a loss to kill the competition? that would be ruthless.

    Small home printer companies do this all the time. you go to Walmart and buy the $40 or the $150 tiny desktop printer? The $40 one is losing money big-time, but hoping to sell to you by undercutting the others, then you buy replacement ink where they make big money.

    #618579
    cmeyer25
    Pro
    Bellingham, WA

    Too bad, I really had hoped the suit would go the other way. But I guess the whole “sensing flesh” thing was too similar. Even if the recoil mechanism was totally different. I hope Bosch sticks it out for after the patent is up.

    Charlie
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    #618608
    Doobie
    Moderator

    Actually, there are laws in the US and Canada to prevent companies from selling below cost in an effort to destroy competition. I took this stuff up decades ago in business school. In Canada it’s the Combines Act I believe, and in the US I believe it is called the Sherman Anti-Trust law.

    https://learning.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/05/15/may-15-1911-supreme-court-orders-standard-oil-to-be-broken-up/?_r=0

    #618675
    theamcguy
    Pro
    Fayetteville, NC

    but Bosch has said that they will simply manufacture the cartridges in the USA since the ban is on import not manufacture or sale

    Man that is a lot of money to spend for how many saws? I mean how many Reaxx saws did Bosch sell in the US, really?

    Automotive Pro
    Fayetteville, NC

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