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How do you cope and stick?

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  • #527140
    MTRoads
    Pro
    Near Glacier National Park, MT

    I have seen some that have grips that resemble a hand plane knob and tote. Others that have a handle that looks like a hand saw handle.

    Anyone have a coping sled with either of these types of grip or handle that can shed some light on the good (or bad) points?

    Stan
    From the Northwest corner of Montana.

    #527149
    PerfectStud
    Pro
    Coralville, IA

    We had 3 dedicated shapers in the cabinet shop. The sticking set up had a 3 roller auto feeder on it that made sticking a dream. As for coping the heavier the sled the better the cut. Ours was a cast iron relic that out performed anything new we tried. The third was dedicated to panel shaping and could not be hooked up to the vac system as it clogged about 2 seconds into any cut. We ended up using a plywood deflector into a barrel.

    If you do much profile cutting the older delta shapers from 70’s back are cheap and clean.

    #527178

    Here’s a nice commercial sled from Woodpeckers:

    http://www.woodpeck.com/copingsled.html

    It should give folks some ideas I believe.

    #527194
    jponto07
    Moderator
    Bloomington, IN

    Here’s a nice commercial sled from Woodpeckers:

    http://www.woodpeck.com/copingsled.html

    It should give folks some ideas I believe.

    The Woodpecker’s sled looks great…id say it’s the one to beat as far as commercially available sleds. In fact, I’ve nearly bought one on a few occasions. If I needed one any more than I do or it cost a bit less, I probably would have done so by now.

    Jon P.
    Timber Carpentry & Construction
    https://www.facebook.com/timbercarpentry/
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    #527201
    PerfectStud
    Pro
    Coralville, IA

    Took a while but I found the newer version of the sled I used. It’s the weaver hd226w. Doesn’t look that cool but their site has a good video that shows how fast you can cope with it.

    It also adjusts to the t track on you specific table for that perfect 90. It also has hold downs on the rail to keep it from riding up the bit.

    Wish I had more pictures from when I worked there. This jig can handle very small coping tasks to monster barn door rails.

    #527216
    PerfectStud
    Pro
    Coralville, IA

    Man I haven’t thought of sticking and coping for a couple years. I just thought of a trick we used to remove the chatter on sticking when we used the smaller cutter heads. Take a coped scrap and clamp it in a vertical tenoning jig and remove the tenon on the table saw. Take a piece of psa sand paper and stick it to the coped face for a profile sanding block. 1 or 2 passes to remove the chatter and the joints are still super tight.

    Also we kept matched scraps of sticking and coping so we could very quickly duplicate a set up by setting the scrap on the table and adjusting the cutter to fit the scrap.

    Hope these will save you a bit of time on your doors

    #527219
    MTRoads
    Pro
    Near Glacier National Park, MT

    We had 3 dedicated shapers in the cabinet shop. The sticking set up had a 3 roller auto feeder on it that made sticking a dream. As for coping the heavier the sled the better the cut. Ours was a cast iron relic that out performed anything new we tried. The third was dedicated to panel shaping and could not be hooked up to the vac system as it clogged about 2 seconds into any cut. We ended up using a plywood deflector into a barrel.

    If you do much profile cutting the older delta shapers from 70’s back are cheap and clean.

    I fully agree that shapers are the way to go if there is room, the custom door shop I worked at had 4 large shapers with power feeds – a dream to use.
    But this conversation, I think, is towards smaller shops. I definitely don’t have room for 2 or 3 shapers, but I do have one that I need to rebuild.
    The image below is the same model I have, but mine is currently stripped down the the last bolt – it will be a complete rebuild.

    Stan
    From the Northwest corner of Montana.

    Attachments:
    #527227
    MTRoads
    Pro
    Near Glacier National Park, MT

    Some great info on coping sleds above. I got some good ideas from the Woodpecker sled, now to get out some of the plastic plate material I have and see what I have laying around for 80/20 stock and see what materializes.

    The Weaver looks awesome also, but that kind of setup will have to wait until the shaper is restored.

    Will report back when I have a new and improved (yet still simple and affordable) coping sled. 🙂

    Stan
    From the Northwest corner of Montana.

    #527232
    PerfectStud
    Pro
    Coralville, IA

    Check out Wolfe machinery for parts for the shaper. That is identical to the ones we had. They have parts and accessories that are no longer made.

    Has any one looked into putting the router set up on the table saw to utilize it’s fence and t tracks for sticking and coping? I think that if the router was on the right side table you could use the fence with a build out clamped to it. Having the extra table space of the saw top would be very nice for coping.

    #527257
    MTRoads
    Pro
    Near Glacier National Park, MT

    Thanks for the tip on Wolfe Machinery for parts. One thing I know I will have to order, that this one did not come with, is a good fence. I started at one point going through the parts diagrams to order a complete set of bearings, but got sidetracked with other issues.

    Might be an idea to document the entire process in case someone else takes on a rebuild of one of these shapers. I know it is going to be a learning experience for me.

    Stan
    From the Northwest corner of Montana.

    #527260
    PerfectStud
    Pro
    Coralville, IA

    Good luck on the rebuild there great machines.

    As for router table set up I had looked in to buying a shaper and there were versions that utilized a stacked cutter head system where both sticking and coping were installed at the same time. The sticking was the bottom set and coping on top. They used a tall coping sled so that you could do one set up for both processes and just had to add or remove the sled. I have not looked but there might be stacked router bits. Would be very convenient in a tight shop

    #527327
    smallerstick
    Pro
    North Bay, ON

    Thanks for the tip on Wolfe Machinery for parts. One thing I know I will have to order, that this one did not come with, is a good fence. I started at one point going through the parts diagrams to order a complete set of bearings, but got sidetracked with other issues.

    Might be an idea to document the entire process in case someone else takes on a rebuild of one of these shapers. I know it is going to be a learning experience for me.

    Shop space is a big issue for me but I do keep an eye out for one of those old machines. If one came my way, I would find the space for it, I know.

    I would be interested in following a rebuild thread, for sure.

    BE the change you want to see.
    Even if you can’t Be The Pro… Be The Poster you’d want to read.

    #527633
    MTRoads
    Pro
    Near Glacier National Park, MT

    Thanks for the tip on Wolfe Machinery for parts. One thing I know I will have to order, that this one did not come with, is a good fence. I started at one point going through the parts diagrams to order a complete set of bearings, but got sidetracked with other issues.

    Might be an idea to document the entire process in case someone else takes on a rebuild of one of these shapers. I know it is going to be a learning experience for me.

    Shop space is a big issue for me but I do keep an eye out for one of those old machines. If one came my way, I would find the space for it, I know.

    I would be interested in following a rebuild thread, for sure.

    Now that I have more floorspace in the shop following the re-arranging last weekend, I’ll probably pull the shaper out of storage this coming weekend and start laying out the parts. Should be interesting. 🙂

    Stan
    From the Northwest corner of Montana.

    #527643
    PerfectStud
    Pro
    Coralville, IA

    I had one of our local acme store do a search for the stacked coping and sticking bits today and they said that they can get several different profiles in a brand called katana. The ones they found were about $25. At that price they probobly would not last a life time but worth a try. They said that you would only need to set up once if you used a coping sled that was exactly a 1/4″ taller than the table.

    Love to see some pics of the rebuild after you dig it out.

    #527706
    MTRoads
    Pro
    Near Glacier National Park, MT

    I had one of our local acme store do a search for the stacked coping and sticking bits today and they said that they can get several different profiles in a brand called katana. The ones they found were about $25. At that price they probobly would not last a life time but worth a try. They said that you would only need to set up once if you used a coping sled that was exactly a 1/4″ taller than the table.

    Love to see some pics of the rebuild after you dig it out.

    Interesting concept, but I’m not sure I would trust $25 cutters spinning that fast. Will do on the rebuild.

    Stan
    From the Northwest corner of Montana.

    #528881
    woodman_412
    Moderator

    That’s a cool setup with 2 routers set up in one table @MTRoads. Would definitely make things more efficient. I always used one table and changed out the setup as I went with a batch of doors. I’ve been buying my doors lately though since I can buy them cheaper than I can make them.

    Dan

    danpattison.com

    #528886
    MTRoads
    Pro
    Near Glacier National Park, MT

    That’s a cool setup with 2 routers set up in one table @mtroads. Would definitely make things more efficient. I always used one table and changed out the setup as I went with a batch of doors. I’ve been buying my doors lately though since I can buy them cheaper than I can make them.

    I have heard quite a few comments on buying doors cheaper. Where do you get yours from? I might have to look into that.

    Stan
    From the Northwest corner of Montana.

    #528894
    woodman_412
    Moderator

    That’s a cool setup with 2 routers set up in one table mtroads. Would definitely make things more efficient. I always used one table and changed out the setup as I went with a batch of doors. I’ve been buying my doors lately though since I can buy them cheaper than I can make them.

    I have heard quite a few comments on buying doors cheaper. Where do you get yours from? I might have to look into that.

    I buy them through my local material supplier but they are made in Quebec by this company.

    http://www.caronind.com/en

    All things being equal I prefer to make my own doors since it keeps more work in house and I have complete control over the doors but like I said it’s cheaper to buy them and the doors are good quality. It makes more sense business wise to buy them, the woodworker in me likes to make them.

    Dan

    danpattison.com

    #528912
    MTRoads
    Pro
    Near Glacier National Park, MT

    Dan,
    Thanks for the info and insight. I’ll have to look up door companies here in the States, not sure what shipping would be like or if it would offset the exchange rate.

    Stan
    From the Northwest corner of Montana.

    #529940
    PerfectStud
    Pro
    Coralville, IA

    There are a ton of places to order doors and drawer boxes in iowa and Missouri. We tried it for a while but decided to go back to making our own. Ended up costing more for us but we would make sure that the grain on the styles, rails and panels ran all the way through floor to ceiling and wall to wall. It was way to time consuming to eplain how to do it to the guys making the doors.

    I would like to know some of your guys process in coping and sticking. I have done a ton over the years but I’m always looking for a trick if I can. Due to aligning the grain we always sticked (usually needed a few hundred feet for each job) cut all the parts and numbered them then coped. Once all that was ready we set panel buddies then made the panels. Then rolling assembly till all were done. A few trips through the wide belt sander to 220. Then squaring by any men’s nessesary. Usually jointed one side then square cut one end on the Excalibur sliding table saw. Finished the other 2 sides on the “big” table saw. Then hand sanding for what seemed like for ever and edge profile if any.

    How about you?

Viewing 20 posts - 21 through 40 (of 58 total)
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