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Canadian Softwood Lumber Agreement

This topic contains 42 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by  smallerstick 1 year, 2 months ago.

Viewing 20 posts - 21 through 40 (of 43 total)
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  • #626730

    kurt@welkerhomes.com
    Pro
    Owatonna, MN - Minnesota

    In the news today, Mr Trudeau has decided to retaliate. Now let’s see where that goes.

    I saw the news about the retaliation, It sounds like he will focus on products from Oregon as it is one of the Oregon Congressmen or Senators that are pushing for the Tariffs. Coal Shipments that pass through Canada also.

    It does sound like the law is on Canada’s side, this has gone to an international trade court several times in the last 40 years and Canada has won every time.

    IN the end they say it will cost less than an additional $1500 to build a house with the tariffs, but new construction is already skewed so much above existing in our area, we can’d afford additional costs to make that number worse.

    There in lays the crux of the matter. They (the government experts) say only and additional $1500 for a house….and when have the experts ever been correct?….lol.

    Then, the taxes on the house are related to the price of the home, so they will go up too.

    Hey honey! we can still get that house, but we can’t put any appliances in it…lol.

    by my calculations, it takes a small house to keep it at the $1500 number. While there is a lot more that goes into a house, additional costs do add up.

    “they” say that additional employment in the lumber industry in the states will offset the additional cost by adding additional demand????

    #626827

    “they” say that additional employment in the lumber industry in the states will offset the additional cost by adding additional demand????

    I doubt it. Would take a while for the American companies to “tool up” and even then I doubt they could match the efficiency of the Canadian Forestry industry. Dont think the duty is enough to offset the canadian advantage. We have forest management down to a science – and it is cheaper to clearcut mature tree farms, which we now have in abundance

    #626851

    kurt@welkerhomes.com
    Pro
    Owatonna, MN - Minnesota

    “they” say that additional employment in the lumber industry in the states will offset the additional cost by adding additional demand????

    I doubt it. Would take a while for the American companies to “tool up” and even then I doubt they could match the efficiency of the Canadian Forestry industry. Dont think the duty is enough to offset the canadian advantage. We have forest management down to a science – and it is cheaper to clearcut mature tree farms, which we now have in abundance

    Therein lies the problem, the time that it will take the US to ramp up idled mills. The theory is that our lumber industry can just flip a switch and start producing millions or billions of board feet of lumber tomorrow. In a lot of areas the lumber industry will be starting almost from scratch creating logging crews and firing up idled mills that the old employees are gone or in other jobs. Add to that all of the environmental costs and there a problem.

    #626865

    “they” say that additional employment in the lumber industry in the states will offset the additional cost by adding additional demand????

    I doubt it. Would take a while for the American companies to “tool up” and even then I doubt they could match the efficiency of the Canadian Forestry industry. Dont think the duty is enough to offset the canadian advantage. We have forest management down to a science – and it is cheaper to clearcut mature tree farms, which we now have in abundance

    Therein lies the problem, the time that it will take the US to ramp up idled mills. The theory is that our lumber industry can just flip a switch and start producing millions or billions of board feet of lumber tomorrow. In a lot of areas the lumber industry will be starting almost from scratch creating logging crews and firing up idled mills that the old employees are gone or in other jobs. Add to that all of the environmental costs and there a problem.

    I think it goes way beyond this. This barely scratches the surface of it all

    #626898

    “they” say that additional employment in the lumber industry in the states will offset the additional cost by adding additional demand????

    I doubt it. Would take a while for the American companies to “tool up” and even then I doubt they could match the efficiency of the Canadian Forestry industry. Dont think the duty is enough to offset the canadian advantage. We have forest management down to a science – and it is cheaper to clearcut mature tree farms, which we now have in abundance

    Therein lies the problem, the time that it will take the US to ramp up idled mills. The theory is that our lumber industry can just flip a switch and start producing millions or billions of board feet of lumber tomorrow. In a lot of areas the lumber industry will be starting almost from scratch creating logging crews and firing up idled mills that the old employees are gone or in other jobs. Add to that all of the environmental costs and there a problem.

    I think it goes way beyond this. This barely scratches the surface of it all

    Very true. Everything I read seems to arrive at the same conclusion though – guys on the Canadian side will be laid off while the sales guys try to find buyers in the rest of the world, the American guys are already at capacity, and prices will go up while levies are being collected

    Sounds like the only people to win are the guys collecting levies, and anyone who can use this to hide (or as an excuse for) a price hike of more than what is required.

    And it won’t help that now BC doesn’t want to ship western US coal from its ports without applying a similar levy. Considering that the US doesn’t not have the setup in place right now to ship coal west, that could similarly hurt american workers, and again help nobody.

    The last thing we need on either side of the border is a trade war. Our economies are too intertwined to try to change any one part without causing a lot of unintended consequences.

    #626901

    kurt@welkerhomes.com
    Pro
    Owatonna, MN - Minnesota

    The only one that really makes any money on a tariff is the government.

    Your are correct Eric, that the last thing we need is a border trade war.

    #626928

    Politics aside, it is sad that the small lumber mills will get hurt, some of the bigger players will make more in the long run, and the US FED will collect duty that will in all likelihood be deemed unfounded.

    Will

    #629491

    kurt@welkerhomes.com
    Pro
    Owatonna, MN - Minnesota

    Here is a video that explains the dispute fairly well. It is just another thing that we do not need that increases the cost of housing.

    Bryan Baeumler Explains: The softwood lumber dispute

    What's the deal with softwood lumber? HGTV's Bryan Baeumler breaks down the decades-long softwood lumber dispute between Canada and the United States.

    Posted by Maclean's on Tuesday, May 23, 2017

    #629536

    Here is a video that explains the dispute fairly well. It is just another thing that we do not need that increases the cost of housing.

    <figure class=”oe-video-container”>

    <script>(function(d, s, id) { var js, fjs = d.getElementsByTagName(s)[0]; if (d.getElementById(id)) return; js = d.createElement(s); js.id = id; js.src = “//connect.facebook.net/en_US/sdk.js#xfbml=1&version=v2.3”; fjs.parentNode.insertBefore(js, fjs);}(document, ‘script’, ‘facebook-jssdk’));</script>

    Bryan Baeumler Explains: The softwood lumber dispute

    What’s the deal with softwood lumber? HGTV’s Bryan Baeumler breaks down the decades-long softwood lumber dispute between Canada and the United States.

    Posted by Maclean’s on Tuesday, May 23, 2017

    </figure>

    A very clear and accessible summary. Thanks for posting that

    #629558

    smallerstick
    Pro
    North Bay, ON

    Here is a video that explains the dispute fairly well. It is just another thing that we do not need that increases the cost of housing.

    <figure class=”oe-video-container”>

    <script>(function(d, s, id) { var js, fjs = d.getElementsByTagName(s)[0]; if (d.getElementById(id)) return; js = d.createElement(s); js.id = id; js.src = “//connect.facebook.net/en_US/sdk.js#xfbml=1&version=v2.3”; fjs.parentNode.insertBefore(js, fjs);}(document, ‘script’, ‘facebook-jssdk’));</script>

    Bryan Baeumler Explains: The softwood lumber dispute

    What’s the deal with softwood lumber? HGTV’s Bryan Baeumler breaks down the decades-long softwood lumber dispute between Canada and the United States.

    Posted by Maclean’s on Tuesday, May 23, 2017

    </figure>

    Funny, the link didn’t show up in Kurt’s post but it did in Eric’s reply.

    Yes, a very good summary of what has been going on for decades. Thanks.

    There are only two ways to do things; the right way and again.

    #635705

    kurt@welkerhomes.com
    Pro
    Owatonna, MN - Minnesota

    more tariffs have been added as recently as last week. At the end of the article look at the jobs lost list. I have seen some of our lumber increase significantly more than the roughly 27% that the duties have added. Last week O bought some 2 x 10 and they were up at least 50% over where they had been.

    http://nahbnow.com/2017/06/lumber-tariffs-threaten-thousands-of-u-s-jobs-raise-housing-costs/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=1-0710&utm_campaign=mmb2017

    #636405

    kurt@welkerhomes.com
    Pro
    Owatonna, MN - Minnesota
    #636406

    smallerstick
    Pro
    North Bay, ON

    due to wildfires and the tariffs, Is there a looming lumber shortage, Possibly

    http://www.jlconline.com/business/from-what-we-gather-july-10-14-2017_o?utm_source=newsletter&utm_content=Brief&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=JLC_071617%20(1)%20B&he=b10b13606430dce60d4993289987b3020504f62a

    I believe the shortage will be temporary until the roads and the mills can be reopened. Suppliers are taking advantage of this to increase prices; it will probably be a while before they come down again.

    There are only two ways to do things; the right way and again.

    #636446

    kurt@welkerhomes.com
    Pro
    Owatonna, MN - Minnesota

    due to wildfires and the tariffs, Is there a looming lumber shortage, Possibly

    http://www.jlconline.com/business/from-what-we-gather-july-10-14-2017_o?utm_source=newsletter&utm_content=Brief&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=JLC_071617%20(1)%20B&he=b10b13606430dce60d4993289987b3020504f62a

    I believe the shortage will be temporary until the roads and the mills can be reopened. Suppliers are taking advantage of this to increase prices; it will probably be a while before they come down again.

    it always seems like once they get the increase, the prices never go back down.

    #636469

    theamcguy
    Pro
    Fayetteville, NC

    it always seems like once they get the increase, the prices never go back down.

    Sure does seem that way at least until they get a big overstock.

    Automotive Pro
    Fayetteville, NC

    #645098

    Doobie
    Pro

    OLD THREAD WARNING

    Good article and perspective here in last weekends Globe and Mail.

    https://beta.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/industry-news/energy-and-resources/strong-market-helping-to-offset-us-tariffs-on-softwood-carr/article36278762/

    The US lumber coalition might have created the perfect storm for our Canadian softwood suppliers to get a best case scenario.

    #656060

    Old Thread Warning:

    The story progresses and likely will for a while yet. It takes a long time to sort these things out. Canada has applied for a ruling from both NAFTA and WTO.

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/canada-united-states-softwood-duties-wto-1.4422900

    My You Tube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCA5AretE3xPoVDV61AxUdUA

    I don't do a fast job. I don't do a slow job. I do a half fast job.

    #656087

    smallerstick
    Pro
    North Bay, ON

    Old Thread Warning:

    The story progresses and likely will for a while yet. It takes a long time to sort these things out. Canada has applied for a ruling from both NAFTA and WTO.

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/canada-united-states-softwood-duties-wto-1.4422900

    This will drag on for months yet. It always has. And the rulings will go the way they always have. Such a waste of time and resources.

    There are only two ways to do things; the right way and again.

    #656107

    Doobie
    Pro

    Old Thread Warning:

    The story progresses and likely will for a while yet. It takes a long time to sort these things out. Canada has applied for a ruling from both NAFTA and WTO.

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/canada-united-states-softwood-duties-wto-1.4422900

    And just like in past episodes of this repeat performance we will get the rulings in our favour which will be for naught as the fines back to the Americans will get mostly waived to actually finally draft a new agreement. It’s just a friggin game that gets repeated where at the end of the day Canadians get the shaft on a huge amount of money. Makes me sick frankly! 😬

    #656176

    GTokley
    Pro
    Madoc, ON

    Old Thread Warning:

    The story progresses and likely will for a while yet. It takes a long time to sort these things out. Canada has applied for a ruling from both NAFTA and WTO.

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/canada-united-states-softwood-duties-wto-1.4422900

    And just like in past episodes of this repeat performance we will get the rulings in our favour which will be for naught as the fines back to the Americans will get mostly waived to actually finally draft a new agreement. It’s just a friggin game that gets repeated where at the end of the day Canadians get the shaft on a huge amount of money. Makes me sick frankly! 😬

    I think the loggers are always getting shafted. Alot of loggers have got out of logging. I heard in my area there smaller sawmill that hasn’t sawed a log since end of August.

    Greg

    instagram.com/gregtokley/

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