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#2 TEAL TIME,,Lastest MAKITA TOOLS

This topic contains 654 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by  CB 7 hours, 43 minutes ago.

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  • #707760

    CB
    Pro

    Sorpa, is that three iterations of you in your avatar there, each looking closer and closer and closer at the screen? One has to be damn observant to have noticed which finger was pulling the trigger. I’m not curious enough to go back and look, but I do think that the FBI could have used your services!

    #707762

    DirtyWhiteBoy
    Pro
    Honolulu,, Hi.

    So many gimicks in one tool.. My friends that are very good at using a impact would laugh.

    That’s not surprising. Takes years for some to accept change. Reminds me of how everybody mocked lights on them years ago. Now people complain if there is just one and not a ring of them to see better.

    it has nothing to do with accepting. It’s just some people use that type of tool all day every day are very good at feathering the trigger and have no need for the tool to do it for them.

    Dirty

    A Working Pro since 1988!

    Member since January 26, 2013.

    #707763

    DirtyWhiteBoy
    Pro
    Honolulu,, Hi.

    I have yet to see somebody in trades squeezing the trigger of an impact drill with their digitus tertius aka middle finger aka bad finger.

    Have you seen anyone using their middle finger to pull the trigger of a nail gun??

    Dirty

    A Working Pro since 1988!

    Member since January 26, 2013.

    #707768

    Doobie
    Pro

    So many gimicks in one tool.. My friends that are very good at using a impact would laugh.

    That’s not surprising. Takes years for some to accept change. Reminds me of how everybody mocked lights on them years ago. Now people complain if there is just one and not a ring of them to see better.

    it has nothing to do with accepting. It’s just some people use that type of tool all day every day are very good at feathering the trigger and have no need for the tool to do it for them.

    No doubt. I’m no pro and I don’t need that either. As you say, you just get used to your tool in time doin that. I was thinking of the speed setting control being at your fingertips instead of just on the base stem. I can see that being handy at times moving back and forth between different tasks more quickly.

    #707774

    Miamicuse
    Pro
    Fort Lauderdale, Florida

    Makita has an 18V coffee maker, when will they come out with a 18V ramen noodle maker?

    #707779

    CB
    Pro

    Makita has an 18V coffee maker, when will they come out with a 18V ramen noodle maker?

    Ha, I see what you did there.

    #707789

    theamcguy
    Pro
    Fayetteville, NC

    Makita has an 18V coffee maker, when will they come out with a 18V ramen noodle maker?

    Can’t you just use the how water from the coffee maker to make Ramen?

    Automotive Pro
    Fayetteville, NC

    #707796

    bbernardesjr87
    Pro
    Mississauga, Ontario

    I found a new tool released in Japan yesterday.
    It´s a new 18v impact driver, compact version.

    Some specs:

    Weight (including battery): 1.4 kg
    Maximum tightening torque: 140 N · m
    RPM 0 to 3000 0 to 1300
    IPM 0 to 3900 0 to 1600

    Size (mm) (length × width × height) 135 × 79 × 232
    when BL 1830 B is installed)

    #707834

    CB
    Pro

    Makita has an 18V coffee maker, when will they come out with a 18V ramen noodle maker?

    Can’t you just use the how water from the coffee maker to make Ramen?

    That was Sami’s entire point… succinctly and subtly stated.

    It was a diplomatic metaphor to illustrate how it isn’t always necessary to create a tool that “officially” makes Top Ramen, and is labeled as such, when the coffee maker Makita already makes not only can get the job done, but is likely already used to get that job done.

    Just like trigger control. Those with day in and day out experience already know how to feather the trigger, already know to press the head in HARD to prevent cam out, already know to feel the resistance and stop short if unbolting a nut overhead… they have already found ways to accomplish the control that is now “officially” available in the new driver.

    It was around 35-36 years ago when I bought a Makita 6092D cordless drill driver. It simply had a motor and metal chuck. A year or two later Makita offered a 6093D that had a black collar around it. Same motor, same metal chuck, same battery. At the time, I didn’t understand the black collar. Another year goes by, and out comes the 6095d… this time with a keyless chuck, and that same black collar.

    Ok fine. I needed new batteries anyway, and it was cheaper to buy the entire tool kit that included two batteries, with a charger, a metal case, and a tool thrown in for free, than it was to simply buy two batteries. I kind of liked the convenience of the keyless chuck, but still didn’t mess with the black (torque control) ring. I just left it set to “drill” and feathered the trigger and paid attention to my timing to control sink depth of the screw heads.

    Then one day I decided to try the torque control ring. This was around the time that the majority of cabinets had transitioned to veneered particle board instead of wood. I set the ring to 3. Not bad. Not bad at all. It became clear that I was an idiot for not taking advantage of an available feature built into the tool, simply because we were all forced to figure out how to do the same task before the feature was invented.

    Just because we were able to get by without the feature doesn’t make the feature any less useful. And just because we take advantage of the available feature, doesn’t make us any less capable of doing without it.

    Or does it?

    In another thread, I shared the story of how I treated myself to not just one, but two new Hitachi framing nail guns, in part because I wanted to have the genuine Hitachi guns on hand to cruise me out till retirement, because I worry about any business that KKR (invader investment group) gets it’s claws into. My old guns are bump fire, no option for select fire. The new guns are sequential fire. I’ve never had a sequential fire gun before.

    Talk about trigger control. When you only have a bump fire gun, with no select fire option available without ordering parts from Hitachi (something I thought about doing 25 years ago but never got around to it), you have no choice but to learn how to feather the trigger to avoid double taps. I never had the benefit of a mentor, nor youtube videos back then, so I just had to figure out on my own to put my finger on the very edge of the nail gun trigger and let it slip off if I wanted to just fire one, and only one nail.

    Fast forward to these new guns, with a different trigger shape, and that I have left as shipped with sequential fire, as I am slowing down with age and can’t keep my balance steady enough to fast bang on a ladder anymore. But I’m having a heck of a time breaking an old habit of using finger technique to limit the firing sequence, when only one nail will fire anyway, since the gun is doing that control for me now.

    Plus the trigger shape is different, which is not as conducive to the flick technique that I used to do when I wanted to be certain that only one nail would come out. Which leads to my next point:

    All the experience and human control in the world won’t help if the tool itself does not afford the opportunity to exert that control.

    Take variable speed ranges and trigger travel range as an example. The usefulness of manual control over the drill/driver’s speed range is limited by the amplitude of trigger travel… which is really up to the mechanical designers of the drill. So where a new tool adds features such as four speed ranges with a quick select button to change ranges on the fly, the same new tool could end up changing the trigger travel in such a way that reduces manual control over the speed range, since there are other ways to control the speed and torque range available.

    So ultimately, I can see both sides of the argument as valid. No, we don’t need a “Top Ramen” maker in order to make instant soup, when all it takes is hot water from the coffee maker we already have. But while operators improvise solutions to solve problems in the field, engineers innovate solutions to solve the same problems within the tool.

    And eventually, these innovations, like the torque setting ring that didn’t exist when I started drilling holes, but that is now commonplace on every drill manufactured, become no brainers. It makes no sense to not take advantage of the innovation, no matter how bad ass one happens to be.

    #707850

    Sorpa
    Pro
    Pierrefonds, Qc

    Sorpa, is that three iterations of you in your avatar there, each looking closer and closer and closer at the screen? One has to be damn observant to have noticed which finger was pulling the trigger. I’m not curious enough to go back and look, but I do think that the FBI could have used your services!

    Yes sir, me, meself and I.

    #707852

    Sorpa
    Pro
    Pierrefonds, Qc

    I have yet to see somebody in trades squeezing the trigger of an impact drill with their digitus tertius aka middle finger aka bad finger.

    Have you seen anyone using their middle finger to pull the trigger of a nail gun??

    If you are comparing a nail gun with an impact drill then you must be in the wrong trade.

    #707853

    Doobie
    Pro
    #707886

    DirtyWhiteBoy
    Pro
    Honolulu,, Hi.

    I have yet to see somebody in trades squeezing the trigger of an impact drill with their digitus tertius aka middle finger aka bad finger.

    Have you seen anyone using their middle finger to pull the trigger of a nail gun??

    If you are comparing a nail gun with an impact drill then you must be in the wrong trade.

    I guess you have never hung doors with a framing gun and with you middle finger on the trigger.

    Dirty

    A Working Pro since 1988!

    Member since January 26, 2013.

    #708209

    CB
    Pro

    The quote below is being repeated, only so you, dear reader, will know that I had not had the opportunity to RTFM prior to making the enumerated assessments quoted below.

    My updated advice to anyone following this thread, or anyone interested in this tool, is to ignore most of what I wrote in the quote box below regarding the supposed difficulty of chucking Tajima box cutting blades into the Makita XDS01, accept for this one sentence at the end…

    “The above all being said, no amount of educated conjecture beats using the tool in reality. That’s why I asked, “if you have this saw, have you destroyed the factory blades?” I’m still asking, until Amazon can manage to actually deliver the tool itself.”

    Now that the tool, the batteries, and the charger have all been delivered (each came in separate shipments from different sources), I finally opened the box and RTFM. Get this… turns out Makita even RECOMMENDS chucking in 3 segments of 18mm wide snap-off blades, and even shows two pictograms in the instructions on how to mount these box cutter like utility blades in the tool.

    So the idea isn’t a user hack. It was actually incorporated into the design of the tool. The whole issue with the off center hole in the Tajima blades? Completely IMMATERIAL. Makita instructs users to loosen the bolts to the blade holder and FLIP IT AROUND so that the oblong protrusion that normally fits snugly inside the elongated slot of (and locates) the serrated factory drywall blade is reversed and no longer a factor in clamping the non slotted surface of the segmented snap off utility blades.

    The maximum cutting depth is 12.5mm, or 1/2″, when cutting drywall with three segments of snap off blade. It doesn’t have to be the last three segments either. It can be ANY three segments, and the top segment doesn’t have to have any type of hole. This explains why “cedarboarder” on CT was able to clock the blade at an angle, as the retention of the blade is entirely friction from the clamp of the two allen cap screws. There is no other mechanical location feature involved, if using snap-off blades… but rest assured, the use of snap off blades is both sanctioned and recommended by Makita in the manual.

    I usually like a little salt and pepper with my crow… but to be fair, I did say that all of the following quote is conjecture. Now that I’ve read the manual, I wanted to immediately refute and dispel any of the concerns I “conjectured” below.

    For what it is worth, all of the specialty drywall supply houses that I have checked carry Tajima blades. Anyone looking should have no problem finding them.

    Please pass the salt.

    Do you have a link for those alternate Tajima blades by chance @cb? I’d be interested in looking at those possibly should I encounter the same issue the fellow on CT encountered.

    No specific link. But there is no shortage of links resulting from entering “Tajima blades” in any search engine, and you’ll probably want to select your own Canada centric supply source.

    The comments regarding using Tajima snap blades in the XDS01 are quoted from TRThomas. Might be best for you to ask him which specific model Tajima blade he has success with, as there are several models of blades with differing hardnesses, costs, and intended applications.

    My assessment, limited to only looking at online photos of the 18mm wide Tajima blades (nominally 3/4″ as TRThomas mentioned) is as follows:

    1. There is only one circular locating hole in the Tajima snap off blades, whereas the Makita serrated blades designed for the tool are slotted. The long slot is how depth of cut is controlled, relative to the baseplate.

    A controlled depth of cut is critical to blind cutting inside walls, to avoid nicking romex that may be “leaning” up against the inside surface of the drywall, due to scrimping the staple schedule, a pop out from the line pull, heat jacking of the cable from thermal cycling, a previous tenant or homeowner or remodeling contractor tugging on the cable from the box further up or down the stud bay… an unlimited variety of reasons why the romex could be bowed against the back side of that drywall.

    2. The segmentation of the Tajima blades are typically divided into seven snap off sections of 10mm increments each.

    This 10mm segmentation is almost but not quite two times the stroke of the saw, which has only a 1/4″ stroke. If the blade can only be pinned to the saw in one place, due having a circular hole instead of a slotted one, and if the blade can only be snapped in 10 mm increments, which is almost double the length of the stroke, then the blade is likely to end up either too long, or too short.

    This observation puts into perspective what TRThomas mentioned in passing, that he uses “2 or 3 sections of 3/4″ snap off utility blades”. Either 2, or 3 sections. And there is a 10mm difference in between these sections. Yet there is little more than a 3mm difference between 5/8″ and 1/2″ sheetrock.

    3. Tajima also makes solid blades, without segmentation. Cutting premium grade hardened steel conditioned with “Japanese Style” tempering and a “multistep” sharpening process… without mangling the whole point of the blade, which is it’s sharpness and resistance to deformation at the edge… just in order to get the right cutting depth based on the stroke length of the saw and the depth of the material…seems to defeat the “whole point” of getting a Tajima blade in the first place. Besides, that’s not what TRThomas suggested. He suggests snap off blades, not solid blades.

    4. The single, circular mounting hole in Tajima’s 18mm (3/4″ nominal) snap off blades is off center relative to the longitudinal axis of the blade, biased toward the cutting edge. (See Tajima blade image under 2, above)

    The elongated mounting slot in Makita’s drywall blade is also somewhat off center relative to the longitudinal axis of the blade, but is biased toward the opposite end of the principle cutting edge, where the “principle” edge is presumed to be the edge that has the leading radius, to ease plunging into the material.

    Therefore, not only is the utility knife lacking a leading radius to ease the start of stroke into the material on the plunge cut… the off set bias of the Tajima blade’s mounting hole is opposite of the intended primary pushing direction of the tool.

    Granted, the tool can be pushed or pulled in either direction, but the 45 degree angled handle tends to ergonomically dictate a primary cutting direction, with the opposite direction being secondary… useful to complete corners or overcome access challenges, but not as comfortable to do the long straight runs. The primary cutting direction is confirmed by the V notch (for cutting line alignment) in the base plate. There isn’t a V notch on either end of the baseplate. Just one end, in the primary cutting direction, where the radiused corner of the factory blade is.

    I don’t have the tool, so I cannot speak to how a utility blade with an off set mounting hole bias can be mounted to the blade holder designed for blades that also have a slight offset mounting bias, but in the opposing direction. This is something that I might take a look at when or if the tool ever arrives, but I initially intend to keep it simple and just stick with the blade that Makita designed for the tool.

    5. I saved the most obvious for last. The Tajima blade doesn’t have any teeth. That means, I assume, that the cut is relying on friction and hand pressure to move forward along the cut. The Makita blade has long serrations, or teeth, that add a host of extra edges that are oriented more perpendicularly to the motion of the stroke. So the motor in the machine itself is able to assist in the tearing through of the material, because the angled (but nearly horizontal) edges of the teeth are able to tear into the material on the up and down directions of the stroke.

    I can’t visualize how a smooth straight blade, with only a single point, can accomplish as much tearing action per stroke. The Makita blade has an archipelago of sharp points all tearing, and more importantly, also clearing the kerf at once. It seems to me that single smooth blade edge rubbing back and forth would generate a lot of heat, but not an efficient cut.

    The above all being said, no amount of educated conjecture beats using the tool in reality. That’s why I asked, “if you have this saw, have you destroyed the factory blades?” I’m still asking, until Amazon can manage to actually deliver the tool itself.

    #708248

    Doobie
    Pro

    Get this… turns out Makita even RECOMMENDS chucking in 3 segments of 18mm wide snap-off blades, and even shows two pictograms in the instructions on how to mount these box cutter like utility blades in the tool.

    Well oh well! Very interesting. I never even looked at my owners manual and just stored it away. Good to know and thanks for bringing this to my attention CB.

    #708281

    CB
    Pro

    Get this… turns out Makita even RECOMMENDS chucking in 3 segments of 18mm wide snap-off blades, and even shows two pictograms in the instructions on how to mount these box cutter like utility blades in the tool.

    Well oh well! Very interesting. I never even looked at my owners manual and just stored it away. Good to know and thanks for bringing this to my attention CB.

    See Page 8 in the English section of the manual.

    #708285

    CB
    Pro

    Back to Teal Time, and the latest Makita tools.

    Why does Makita delay introducing their most evolved tools to the North American market, with some evolutions never reaching this vast expanse of soil between Pacific and Atlantic oceans?

    Earlier in this thread we were discussing using the Makita 18V coffee maker to make Top Ramen. So here is the North American coffer maker:

    As you can see, the coffee maker above is a clunky ungainly thing with a wire and battery connector dangling down from it with no easy way to grasp it with one hand, no handle, and no provision to manage the accoutrement needed to make it work.

    Now, here is the evolved coffee maker that Makita makes for Japan, and presumably other countries and continents like Europe, Africa, Australia, China, Russia, Antarctica for cryin outloud… just not North America:

    There is a built in flip up single handed carrying handle. An included thermal mug that nestles and is held into place. A built in battery slot for two types of batteries, new 18v LXT and legacy CXT (or other, not quite sure which) batteries, by sliding the built in cover. Everything is tight, right, and neatly self contained, like a Bento box.

    Another view:

    Why can’t we have this?

    Why do we have to provide our own place to lay a battery, and provide our own cup?

    If you were at all inclined to bring along a portable battery operated coffee maker, which would you rather deal with carrying around?

    I was only made aware of the difference by virtue of the fold out brochure included in the package of the 18v tool I recently received. That’s the icing on the cake… the include these brochures inside the boxes of tools shipped to North America, that show products that cannot be obtained in North America.

    #708304

    DirtyWhiteBoy
    Pro
    Honolulu,, Hi.

    I was looking in a Makita Japanese Catalog for a long track and found out they don’t sell track saws in Japan. Those in Japan that want a track get it from the US.

    Dirty

    A Working Pro since 1988!

    Member since January 26, 2013.

    #708305

    DirtyWhiteBoy
    Pro
    Honolulu,, Hi.

    Why can’t we have this?

    That was just released in 2018. Give it some time it will be here. In the ’17 4th quarter Japanese catalog it still shows the old one.

    Dirty

    A Working Pro since 1988!

    Member since January 26, 2013.

    #708308

    Miamicuse
    Pro
    Fort Lauderdale, Florida

    Now, here is the evolved coffee maker that Makita makes for Japan, and presumably other countries and continents like Europe, Africa, Australia, China, Russia, Antarctica for cryin outloud… just not North America:

    It may have to do with the perception (and to some degree it’s true) that we in NA rely so much on driving our own cars, we hardly ever walk out of necessity. Where other countries in Asia with very high density population and mass transportation people tend to walk a lot. So the newer version with a handle may be more adapted to those markets? I don’t know just guessing here.

    I like the Bento box style. Integrated battery slot, may be a couple of small hidden drawers for cookies, energy bars etc…would be useful. Come out with a backpack version I’ll take it camping!

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